Wowpedia talk:Village pump

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Help with sortable table

I want to create a sortable table of the data at User:Brunpal/Sandbox/1. I would like it be like BC_cloth_DPS_equipment/Feet. I'm having problems with the formating especially since there are multiple items for each quest and those quest items may require a note. Media:Quest_data.ods‎ is the source file. It is a list of every quest that the items can be found on the AH. --Brunpal (talk) 15:34, 9 July 2008 (UTC)

Big thanks to User:Gourra for sorting out the table coding! Now I'm looking for page name suggestions to put that info under. Some quests require craftable items or non-soulbound items so I made a list of all the quests you can do by shopping on the AH. Basically it is a table of all quests that you can trade gold for xp. What's a good page name? What are some category suggestions? If you have a suggestion please put it on the page itself User:Brunpal/Sandbox/1.--Brunpal (talk) 16:30, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

Questions for Activision Blizzard CEO Robert Kotick?

Tomorrow morning I am guest hosting CNBC's Squawkbox, and one of my guests will be Robert Kotick, CEO of Activision Blizzard. I will try to bring him your questions. (Not sure how much freedom they will give me to run the show...) What should I ask him, from the wowwiki community?

-- --Jimbo Wales 18:54, 9 July 2008 (UTC)

Awesome, though pity I won't be able to see it in the UK. I guess some general questions would be - would be expect to see any changes to how Blizzard works? As a result are we likely to see any changes to payment structures for the games (e.g. lower monthly subscription fee). What specific benefits does he see for Blizzard's fanbase? Thanks :) Kirkburn  talk  contr 01:25, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

More specifically, "How much does Actiblizzardion intend to interfere with Blizz's internal processes?" --k_d³ 04:42, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

A whole bunch of Oceanic player would love to know when Blizz will start discussing reimbursements for 6 weeks of nightly outages from the release of the WoW 2.4.0 game client. Blizz staff are still stating that the solution is a work in progress. Whilst stability is greatly improved now, compared to those 6 weeks, we've yet to hear anything - we keep getting a 'we'll talk when we're happy it's fixed'. There's a 190+ page post in Blizz's WoW Customer Support forum, that actually breaks the forum software, discussing this. At the current rate, it'd appear WotLK will be out before any discussion of even partial re-imbursements will happen. Is a partial reimbursement at all possible, with final resolution when their tech dept. is happy? (Sorry if I'm rambling a li'l, yeah I know the agreements with Blizz say they don't guarantee stuffs, but... this is fairly extreme and Blizz EU have handed out days of free time for less before) Normal (talk) 04:58, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Get to know question: "What Blizzard games have you played or are you playing now, as you're coming from Activision?" --Sky (t · c · w) 05:04, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

With the considerable investment that Activision is making into Blizzard, will this be used to encourage R&D to stay ahead of the market? Also, will this mean an expansion in staff and perhaps the creation of a fourth Intellectual Property at Blizzard? A little risk would seem warranted considering the operating cushion and the fact that the last (and all) IP at Blizzard was created in the 90's. - Ansu 05:14, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

I got the chance to ask this one. The answer was not that informative, though, he just talked about stuff they have already announced. No scoops today! :)----Jimbo Wales 14:27, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Will Activision leave Blizzard alone and let them continue to produce quality content? - AlexanderYoshi (talk)

Will Activision try applying the principles of spending extra polish time on their own games? - AlexanderYoshi (talk)

What does Activision feel is the greatest benefit it recieves as a company by merging with Blizzard to form Blizzard Activision, beyond just money? -- AlexanderYoshi (talk)

Thursday morning videos from CNBC: Gaming on the Economy | Parting Shots

Transparency categorization

I am wondering how to categorize images with a transparent background (and good-to-OK attempts at a transparent background to a lesser extent) made in the WoW model viewer. Category:WoW Model Viewer PNG images seems correct per the transparency guidelines, but not all images in that category are transparent, just in the proper format to be if they were (see Image:CorruptedAshbringerMV.PNG). Jim the Inventor made Category:Adapted game screenshots for them, which seems a better idea. Well, the category name and descriptive sentance still needs work, but a separate category or a rehash somewhere seems needed.--SWM2448 21:12, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

While the Category:WoW Model Viewer PNG images doesn't require the image to be transparent, only guidelines are that it was taken from the WMV and is a PNG file, the Category:Adapted game screenshots says to me that they were taken in WoW then edited to be transparent... Thats what the category sounds like to me, though that doesn't seem to be the case, the adapted game screenshots category looks like it's being used as a combination of Category:WoW Model Viewer PNG images and Category:WoW Model Viewer JPG images. Sssssssssssssssssssssssss For Pony! ^{{TDon't hiss at me.•CIf you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all.)} 21:35, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Some disambiguation or specificity is needed here.--SWM2448 21:46, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Perhaps a new category a Category:Transparent images for images with just a transparent background, and the ones with gray backgrounds can go into the WoW model viewer categories. The transparent category won't matter if they are from the WMV or in-game as you'll only see the object/npc/mob anyway. Sssssssssssssssssssssssss For Pony! ^{{TDon't hiss at me.•CIf you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all.)} 21:50, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

While 'transparent' and 'same grey as the default skin' are not the same thing, what difference does it make? To be usable on all skins?--SWM2448 21:55, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Only difference, really, would be the way it's categorized... I guess, And I think the category Category:Adapted game screenshots (well before case was change it was Category:Adapted Game Screenshots) was there long before Ose made the new categories... not sure if he knew the other existed or not, but it might have been an attempt to replace the old category. Sssssssssssssssssssssssss For Pony! ^{{TDon't hiss at me.•CIf you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all.)} 22:04, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

The images can have more than one category, like one for the source and one for the background type. Is it really necessary to show the difference between the two types of transparency?--SWM2448 22:13, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Then I guess you can use either one... cause I don't know. All I know is that Ose created the separate categories to keep PNG, JPG, and GIF files apart. And all three types will be more or less transparent. Sssssssssssssssssssssssss For Pony! ^{{TDon't hiss at me.•CIf you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all.)} 22:24, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Will be, but what if they are not?--SWM2448 22:32, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Then...um....um...uh.... slap the uploader? LOL We could however state in the image guidelines to info all that upload WMV images to set the background to the default WoWwiki background color (R-51,B-51,G-51). Sssssssssssssssssssssssss For Pony! ^{{TDon't hiss at me.•CIf you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all.)} 22:35, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Got it. We sort them, and then slap Peregrine. Good idea with the guideline thing (there are also more ways to set it).--SWM2448 22:47, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Well, I emptied out Category:Adapted game screenshots, filed the images based on type, and then put cleanup tags on the non-transparent ones. I feel Peregrine is too inactive to slap, and he may have been slapped already. I still feel a true consensus was not reached here, but it is a bit better.--SWM2448 21:53, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

The guidelines for WMV screenshots are set out here. I think it's too much work to categorize them based on their transparency - you can tell from the categories whether they are up to par. PNG images which are not transparent should be, and JPG images should have the WoWWiki bg, so it's something for a cleanup crew to tag really, not base categories upon. Kirkburn  talk  contr 23:42, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Death Knight Class Color

Death knights need an official color! Class colors seem to be (appropriately) buried deep within some basic style sheet on the site somewhere that simple users like me probably don't have access to. The only reference I could find to where this might be was here: [1]. So I'll leave it to the professionals to update things appropriately.

Two key pages I know of that need to display the class colors specifically are the following: Class colors & Class#Class_colors. And AFAIK, these are the Death knight color values: RBG(dec) = 0.77, 0.12, 0.23; RGB(255) = 196, 30, 59; and Hex = #C41E3A.

Although the only "official" source for this info would be the FrameXML/Fonts.xml file in the alpha client which you may or may not still consider under NDA, I still think this info is basic enough that it's high time it get added to this site to make sure the groundwork is there for users to utilize it. There are numerous public sites that are displaying the Death knight's color now, anyway, including wowhead & mmo-champion.

-- Pyro (talk) 00:38, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

I've added the basic class - not all finished, but a start. It seems fairly innocuous as additions go. Thanks! Kirkburn  talk  contr 14:22, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

Default wiki skin

How can I say this delicately? ... ... nope, nothing comes to mind. How about, I simply give you the directions to see what I see: Firefox 3 (no saved login data). Javascript disabled. Images disabled generally, auto-allow for images.wikia.com and images1.wikia.nocookie.com. Not signed in.

Horrifying is too weak a term for it. The main page was so badly organized, I had to try going to some other page (any other page) to find text for the login button. (Logging in brought forth my chosen skin, and rationality returns.) Text on backgrounds that made it difficult to find/read.

I am desperately hoping I caught the wiki in some "betwixt and between" state with someone working on it. -- Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 19:00, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

Well, with *images* disabled I don't see any point why would see a sensible result.   Armagone (<imagelink></imagelink> <imagelink>http://images.wikia.com/wowwiki/images/5/51/BinderGossipIcon.png|Special:Contributions/Armagone</imagelink>)  11:02, 12 July 2008 (UTC)

You should still be able to navigate the page without undue difficulty. --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 15:50, 16 July 2008 (UTC)

Can you provide a screenshot of what you saw/see? Kirkburn  talk  contr 16:17, 16 July 2008 (UTC)

Equals sign in template parameters (questlong)

Is there any way of providing an equals sign as part of a string parameter in a template? Specifically, in questlong.

The quest "Potential for Brain Damage = High", for example, requires the '=' to be removed in order to work in the template. I can't find any way to escape it. Help:Template#Equal_signs_in_parameter_values didn't seem to help much. -- w.woods (talk) 06:35, 16 July 2008 (UTC)

Use =, which does the same thing. g0urra[T҂C] 07:57, 16 July 2008 (UTC)

Thanks! I tried that before I posted, but I must have left the semicolon off, or something --w.woods (talk) 01:07, 17 July 2008 (UTC)

{{questlong|faction|level|3=questname}}. Call the number in this case, as I'm not sure there's a non-numerical value given to it. --Sky (t · c · w) 02:21, 17 July 2008 (UTC)

Wrath of the Lich King beta

It has begun...

Basically, it's now a free for all on beta content - let's try and limit the amount of obviously unfinished alpha stuff, and concentrate on what's been completed. Courtesy of kd3, we now have thousands of extra pages and images. You can see the images on Special:Log/upload - if there are any that are unused, please link them into appropriate articles! The imported pages shown on Special:Log/import should all be in their natural places, though the categories may need creation (if so, please make sure it follows other categories of that type).

Enjoy! Kirkburn  talk  contr 12:35, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

A toast to all who stemmed the flow of NDA material before today!--SWM2448 18:17, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

Woot, thanks for the +20 stam buff sandwichman. Sssssssssssssssssssssssss For Pony! ^{{TDon't hiss at me.•CIf you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all.)} 18:32, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

We now have a portal up dedicated to Wrath content - see Portal:WotLK. If you need to tweak or fix bits, please do. There's only a couple of red links, and hopefully those should be gone soon. Kirkburn  talk  contr 23:40, 19 July 2008 (UTC)

Citation is useless now?

All that work citing... When is a WotLK preview link to be kept? We do not often cite things that are 'common knowlage from the game'.--SWM2448 23:47, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

The meaning of...

well i was looking up some stuf at wowwike but sometimes i see some words that i just cant figure out... i know what low and mid is but how do i know what low- and medium-levels are? 10-20? 10-30? idk! so it would be nice if there whas a special page where some of those words are explained. -- Domyras (talk) 14:01, 19 July 2008 (UTC)

Assuming this is a real question... my personal estimates are: low level = 0-30, medium-level = 30-55, high-level = 55-70. See also Category:Game terms. Kirkburn  talk  contr 23:38, 19 July 2008 (UTC)

Elinks for WOTLK

All elinks template added to new WotLK articles don't work; wowhead for example uses a new site with prefix "wotlk." (wotlk.wowhead.com) to designate new content. Suggestion to fix this? -- 20:47, 19 July 2008 (UTC)

For a start:

{{elinks-item/wotlk|<item_id>}}

{{elinks-NPC/wotlk|<npc_or_mob_id>}}

{{elinks-spell/wotlk|<spell_id>}}

Mostly only works for Wowhead. Thottbot has a DB, but is woefully lacking in much stuff. Allakhazam doesn't appear to have any beta DB. -- Fandyllic (talk · contr) 5:18 PM PST 1 Aug 2008

Also now: {{elinks-quest/wotlk|<quest_id>}} -- Fandyllic (talk · contr) 2:30 PM PST 4 Aug 2008

I also noticed {{elinks-faction/wotlk|<faction_id>}} and {{Dbsearchlink/wotlk|<search_string>}}. -- Fandyllic (talk · contr) 2:24 PM PST 9 Aug 2008

Added {{elinks-zone/wotlk|<zone_id>}}. The ID may not be common across DBs, so use th=thottbot_zone_id, if the thottbot one doesn't match. -- Fandyllic (talk · contr) 3:28 PM PST 12 Aug 2008

Death knight faction

Is it Knights of the Ebon Blade or Knights of the Ebon Hand?--SWM2448 20:58, 19 July 2008 (UTC)

Everything seems to point to ebon blade, ebon hand might have been just another name for it... Sssssssssssssssssssssssss For Pony! ^{{TDon't hiss at me.•CIf you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all.)} 01:14, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

Message won't go away

I got a message from a different wiki a couple of weeks ago with an account also called Mr.X8 and even on this site it says I have a new message, except on a different site, and like I said "It's been a couple of weeks".   Mr.X8 Talk Contribs 19:10, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

Have you tried looking at the said message on the other wiki? The usertalk on wikia is linked.--SWM2448 20:56, 21 July 2008 (UTC)

Yes. Because I follow the link, though I'm automatically logged onto my other one, I think.   Mr.X8 Talk Contribs

It worked. Thanks Sandwichman!   Mr.X8 Talk Contribs 21:01, 21 July 2008 (UTC)

Uh-Oh

I decided to try out for beta and they'd email me if I'm chosen. However I've changed and gained like a dozen email accounts since I gave my credentials to WoW. They only list one letter of my email account and bleeped out 4 others. I don't have any such email address such as this, how can I change it to one of my current ones?   Mr.X8 Talk Contribs 21:18, 21 July 2008 (UTC)

I found out how to do it, but it won't except it. If and when I change it, will the thing about beta get to me?   Mr.X8 Talk Contribs 02:11, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

This is not Blizzard Customer Service. I suggest you contact them. --PcjWowpedia wiki manager (TDrop me a line!•C207,729 contributions and counting) 02:19, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

I have! The line won't go through it just gives me the busy sound   Mr.X8 Talk Contribs 02:25, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

Builds for Wrath of The Lich King

Could some people please post possible builds for all classes that include the knew class Death Knight and could the builds be for Wrath of the Lich King? -- Picklevendor (talk) 22:27, 22 July 2008 (UTC)

Don't post irrelevant jokes, please. As for your question, it is very early days yet. Kirkburn  talk  contr 22:35, 22 July 2008 (UTC)

Just look around wowwiki Picklevendor. I have seen a few possible builds already on here.  Rolandius  (talk - contr) 22:38, 22 July 2008 (UTC)

Combat Events (API) listing

The list of events in the Combat category is dominated by obsolete events which are marked with the text "Replaced in 2.4.0 with COMBAT_LOG_EVENT." How long are we going to have these obsolete events remain in the list? I know I personally don't like having to wade through a sea of obsolete events and other details when looking for documentation that may help my work on various addons. I propose moving these old events to another page if we want to keep them for historical purposes. In any case, I find it counterproductive to leave the list as it is now. Perhaps there is a policy regarding what we do with obsolete API information that I'm unaware of; if not, I think we need one, as we're only going to have more obsolete information as time goes on, especially with 3.0 on its way. -- Tuhljin (talk) 00:37, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

Naturally, I'd say move the obsolete events to a new section at the bottom of the page. --Sky (t · c · w) 00:40, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

The problem with that is that the "page is automatically generated; editing it is pointless." Even editing each individual entry won't put them in a new section of obsolete functions. I'm not sure how to best proceed with this. -- Tuhljin (talk) 02:15, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

I asked the bot-runner to comment, so maybe he'll make an appearance? >.> --Sky (t · c · w) 03:24, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

My suggested solution is to move all the outdated stuff from Events/C (which is the editable original) to Events/Removed, which I just created. Events listed in /Removed will not be populated to the category pages by the bot. --Mikk (T) 05:08, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

World of warcraft item categories

The World of Warcraft item categories (especially Category:World of Warcraft uncommon items, Category:World of Warcraft common items, Category:World of Warcraft rare items, and Category:World of Warcraft epic items) are too damn huge, to the point of not being navigable or practical. I think we should split it up somehow, probably by item level, and possibly have {{tooltip}} automatically categorize these so all we'd have to do is get a bot to remove the existing categories. Thoughts? --PcjWowpedia wiki manager (TDrop me a line!•C207,729 contributions and counting) 01:40, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

I was thinking to split them up by drop locations, as many of them already are. I know there is a world drop category; have another category for purchaseable, another for instance drops, etc etc? --Sky (t · c · w) 02:04, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Possibly, there would still be a ton in each category. And we'd have to employ Foxbot for that approach, too complex for anything like AWB to handle. --PcjWowpedia wiki manager (TDrop me a line!•C207,729 contributions and counting) 02:07, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Not really. We can start off by pulling items from the variety of categories dedicated to instance loot, a la Category:World of Warcraft items by instance. I don't know how to progress from there. --Sky (t · c · w) 02:14, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Mmm, Foxbot tends to fail at world drop items anyway. I think we should probably come up with a more complete list of divisions before actually moving categories around. --PcjWowpedia wiki manager (TDrop me a line!•C207,729 contributions and counting) 02:16, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Sure. Most of the world drops have already been categorized in this manner I think, so it isn't so big an issue. --Sky (t · c · w) 02:21, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

I'm not sure I agree with this - {{bigcat}} exists to help navigation around large categories. The resulting categories per instance would also be very long - "World of Warcraft Temple of Ahn'Qiraj common items" - quite a mouthful. Kirkburn  talk  contr 12:49, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Not really, since a search on WoWhead gave me 7 results. g0urra[T҂C] 12:52, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Bigcat is less logical for navigation than using subcategories. People don't usually look by name when browsing categories, if they know part of the name they use search. --PcjWowpedia wiki manager (TDrop me a line!•C207,729 contributions and counting) 12:57, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Kirkburn, you mistake me. I meant, quite simply, "Category:World of Warcraft rare instance drops", not "Category:World of Warcraft rare <instance> drops". --Sky (t · c · w) 17:16, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Aha, that does make more sense, and I think I could agree to that :) Kirkburn  talk  contr 17:18, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Calling all beta participants!

If you're in the beta and are looking for fellow WoWWikians, get your name down on WoWWiki:WotLK beta contacts with your user name and beta characters so we can find each other. Kirkburn  talk  contr 13:43, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Location maps

Rascilon has recently been uploading maps to highlight where locations exist - for example Image:Westfall brigade camp map.jpg. I like the idea, since our location articles don't generally say exactly where they are, but I can't help but think there's probably a much better way to do it using templates.

Similar the the NPC co-ordinate template, could we create a template to position PNG image highlights over locations? Kirkburn  talk  contr 23:52, 25 July 2008 (UTC)

As I have been informed by pcj, {{Zone Map}} replicated much of this - however, it could do with a transparent overlay image for areas. Kirkburn  talk  contr 00:07, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

I personally find it silly to upload highlighted maps for an area that is labeled. If it was a place that was not marked on the map like many places are I would actually enjoy having a highlighted map to show me. Still... uploading the same image (with a different part highlighted) for every place within a zone seems excessive. So if Zone Map can be changed to add a green highlight that would be nice. Sssssssssssssssssssssssss For Pony! ^{{TDon't hiss at me.•CIf you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all.)} 00:28, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

I do agree that uploading new maps for each individual area is over the top, and would probably end up as too much effort in the long run. Kirkburn  talk  contr 00:54, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

Was just playing with it, first time I actually noticed you can change the size of it... but it has no float parameter, that could be useful towards the future as well. Sssssssssssssssssssssssss For Pony! ^{{TDon't hiss at me.•CIf you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all.)} 01:07, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

popular pages

Hm, i miss the popular pages widget. Previously there was one under the search tab. it showed patch mirrors, aldor and scryer, black temple. etc Zurgat (talk) 12:23, 29 July 2008 (UTC)

Not sure what you mean - there is still a "Popular content" menu on the sidebar, and you can visit Special:Widgets to add the "Most visited" widget. Do you mean something different?

I most certainly don't see that one. just nav, search and toolbox. Zurgat (talk) 09:16, 30 July 2008 (UTC)

Regarding widgets, a new one was launched today - Bookmarks. You can add pages from the wiki to it as you go around with a single click. Kirkburn  talk  contr 21:21, 29 July 2008 (UTC)

Travel hubs changes

Xaatyrus was bold recently and changed how the travel hubs sections work on zone articles. We started a discussion on User talk:Xaatyrus, which I'm now continuing here.

Essentially the change was to move the exact details of each flight point to the individual town/flightpoint articles. To be honest the situation seems rather muddled now as it has been partially reverted. So, what do people think - should the details of where each flight point connects to belong on the zone article? (Remember that with the current flight system, where everything connects is not as important as it once was). Kirkburn  talk  contr 12:11, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

To be honest I saw no reason in the apparent change to remove the information of connection between flight paths, as players can often get stranded and don't know what flight paths connect to it. Some of the changes has been reverted, and want to see what other people think about this matter. g0urra[T҂C] 12:15, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

I am coming down on the side of 'yes, it should be there'. However, I do like how Xaatyrus was adding the info to the individual town locations too. Kirkburn  talk  contr 12:20, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

I'm fine with adding the same information to the town articles, but not with removing any information from the zone articles. g0urra[T҂C] 12:23, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Methinks was are agreed. Kirkburn  talk  contr 12:28, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Ok, then I'll stop removing the flight paths from the zone pages, but I hope it's ok to finish adding the flight routes for the last hubs in Outland. ~JBF~ (talk) 15:47, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Absolutely continue adding info. Kirkburn  talk  contr 17:01, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Would it make sense to show this information graphically instead of in a long list? Or perhaps move it all to a separate article on flight paths? I agree that the lists do sort of clutter up the page. Also boo! I have returned from my lurking :O --Jiyambi t || c

Welcome back, Jiyambi! I was thinking about graphically too, but was unsure how to make it look. --PcjWowpedia wiki manager (TDrop me a line!•C207,729 contributions and counting) 16:54, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Holy moley, it's Jiyambi! Rejoice! Kirkburn  talk  contr 17:01, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

HAIL THE RETURN OF JIYAMBI! Happy now? Look at this edit to Exodar. It seems to have removed more information than just what is required for the reorganization. While the info is from the BC launch, and its usefulness debatable, it is still not just flight point clutter so it begs the question of what other extra info was removed.--SWM2448 23:14, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Ok, I'll put the information back. I was trying to remove as little as possible, but found that this info was irrelevant. Will put the information under the "Notes" section. Whether the isles are accessible to non-BC users or not has nothing to do with transportation. Edit: Jiyambi, there is actually a separate flight path page with info on the time and cost of the flight paths aswell, check out Flight path/Kalimdor, Flight path/Eastern Kingdoms and Flight path/Outland. The Northrend page isn't finished yet though. ~JBF~ (talk) 10:59, 2 August 2008

I'm back

Not that anyone missed me, but you can start reverting my edits again... ;-)

I'm also on the beta, so I'll be uploading images and such. I don't have any Horde toons there, so hopefully those with Hordies will upload stuff too. -- Fandyllic (talk · contr) 3:37 PM PST 1 Aug 2008

Oh Noes, the Tadpoles! g0urra[T҂C] 22:41, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Fandy how dare you return at the same time as me and steal my hubub! I can't exactly welcome you back since I haven't been here either, but... nice to see you again!--Jiyambi t || c 23:19, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Meh, same. Was hard stopping myself from correcting all the mistakes i saw, but i realized i came to enjoy not editing the wiki for a while. so don't expect to see my editing much any time soon.-- Zeal ^(T/C)  23:16, 4 August 2008 (UTC)

Participate in my research project on collaborative writing(?)

Members of the WoWWiki community are invited to participate in a research study about the collaborative writing on WoWWiki.com. My hope is to work closely with the community to accurately describe patterns collaborative writing activities such as reading and responding, collecting and recollecting information, and writing and revising on WoWWiki.

Much of what I'll be looking at will be interactions on article discussion pages and the Village Pump, and I hope to follow up that research with interviews about your experiences contributing to the wiki.

• I highly value receiving feedback from the community, so I'm happy to respond to any questions or comments here or via email @ hunter dot rik at gmail dot com.

[Update: I was lucky enough to get a BlizzCon ticket, so if you're going, I'd love to hear about your experiences related to WoWWiki.]

• I also have 3 surveys you are invited to take which will take about 5 minutes, each, to complete. They are linked from my website.

• You can also learn more about me and my research here.

[Update: There's a PDF of the proposal available at the url. Feel free to download, look it over, leave feedback there or here. Tell me if I have anything wrong! ;)]

Thanks! Dakhma (talk) 21:15, 4 August 2008 (UTC)

Not to dishearten or stop you, but research studies on WoWWiki seem to have a bad reputation. They are often possible attempts to collect e-mail addresses from WoWWikians, odd or just sarcastic.--SWM2448 21:55, 4 August 2008 (UTC)

I took all 3 surveys. They probably take less than 5 minutes each (unless you're writing an essay for each answer). I'd also like to point out that self-selecting studies are some of the weakest type and they lack credibility in my mind. Still, the surveys are easy. -- Fandyllic (talk · contr) 3:12 PM PST 4 Aug 2008

Couldn't care less the effectiveness of this, but i took all 3 surveys, as it takes no time at all when bored. -- Zeal ^(T/C)  23:27, 4 August 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the heads-up, SWM2448. I'm hoping my level of disclosure regarding my study with assuage any fears of the community. First, the surveys are on SurveyMonkey and don't require any sort of registration. (Fandyllic, great point. I'm not looking to generate any generalizability out of the data. But I'm thinking the surveys are a quick and dirty way to get a feeling for the ways people are feeling and thinking of their participation on WoWWiki. And, maybe the results will give me a bit more to go on when/if I get the chance to interview WoWWikians. At the end of the day, I do feel the responses received are important -- I'll share them with the community -- but validity regarding any hypotheses isn't what I'm after. Hope that explanation helps?) Back to SWM2448 -- I do not see myself collecting anyone's email address; rather, (though a time for email exchanges may come) my plan is to for interviews via chat or even Skype or f2f -- for instance, I want to snag one of those Blizzcon tickets and maybe I could talk to any WoWWikians who will also be there. Further, I've posted links to my personal site, which has information on who I am, what I do, and where I am. Please don't spam me. ;)

Basically, while I haven't been a WoWWiki contributor in the past, I have been an extensive user since I started playing WoW in 2005, and I wouldn't want to do anything to hurt the community. In fact, I plan to share much of my research as it's in progress for the community to see -- especially the survey results and giving any interviewees final approval on transcripts on interviews. Additionally, I'm doing discourse analysis of article discussion pages and Village Pump discussion, and my analysis requires the input of the community to tell me where I got something just plain wrong.

Thanks to those who have taken the surveys so far! Dakhma (talk) 01:01, 5 August 2008 (UTC)

I can vouch for Dakhma by the way - he contacted me a while back about this, and chatted with us on IRC yesterday. Kirkburn  talk  contr 10:43, 5 August 2008 (UTC)

I've actually been watching your work for a while (it cropped up on Google while I was hunting fruitlessly for references for Wikipedia), and was pleased to see a flash presentation on it. I didn't want to disturb (poison?) the research, as at the time you seemed to be outside looking in. But now that you want feedback... :) --Sky (t · c · w) 08:04, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

A couple minor corrections I'd like to make:

• In 1.4: "While WoWWiki is still managed by lead adminis-trators from before the move to Wikia, WoWWiki is now an ad supported site and is “run” by Wikia. " — WoWWiki, for the most part, has always had advertisements, only they were Google text in the sidebar rather than the headers, skyscrapers, and blocks that we're served now by Wikia.
• Another: "WoWHead" is actually "Wowhead" and not the more common but wrong "WoWHead".
• In section 2.1, you have a typo "limited review [of] some of the" and "the history [of] collaborative writing and writing". Missing two "of"s in there where I bracketed them. There's another "of" missing in the second sentence after that... The draft might be of benefit with a fine-toothed comb copyedit for missing words, as the rest of your writing seems thought out and deliberate, whereas those mistakes seem to be of the mindless sort that most writers (typers!) make. --Sky (t · c · w) 08:42, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the feedback Sky! I want to get the history of the wiki correct, so those details will help (and I'll surely need more help in the future). And you're right about the copyediting; it's always hard to catch everything yourself -- another reason why collaborative sites like WoWWiki are awesome. Dakhma (talk) 14:39, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

Promoting my RTS project

I cleaned up my RTS units project to have what is needed to be a project per WoWWiki:Projects, so if there is interest in it let me know.--SWM2448 23:42, 4 August 2008 (UTC)

Incorrect citations

Just an observation, I am not sure how important it is, but 90% of the citations on wowwiki from the game manuals are wrong. When citing from PDF documents make sure you are entering the correct page by "manual" and not by "sidebar". The sidebar counts the front cover, table of contents, system requirements, back cover, and etc. as pages while they are not numbered pages in the manual. With the exception of Warcraft III, the manuals seem to be off by a few pages. Warcraft III though seems to be dozens of pages off. I will try to fix any that I come across but I think there are literally dozens of citations to be fixed.  Rolandius  (talk - contr) 04:20, 5 August 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the heads up. I think if citations are in the right book and can be found, the citation is okay, but needs page number fixing when possible. Page numbers are nice, but not absolutely necessary. My real concern are citations that are just plain bogus. -- Fandyllic (talk · contr) 12:50 PM PST 5 Aug 2008

The citation can vary from one edition of the manual to the other. For example I have a manual of the Warcraft 2 UK edition which at all isn't the same as the US Warcraft 2 edition. You shouldn't be picky about the page numbers at all, just as Fandy said above. g0urra[T҂C] 19:55, 5 August 2008 (UTC)

Okay. Although I don't think it is because of the edition because the wrong citations match up with my "sidebar" observation. Also, you are still forgetting that the some of the Warcraft I citations and 90% of the Warcraft III citations are really off, by about 100 pages in the Warcraft III example.  Rolandius  (talk - contr) 20:16, 5 August 2008 (UTC)

75% of percentages are made up on the spot 50% of the time. Sssssssssssssssssssssssss For Pony! ^{{TDon't hiss at me.•CIf you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all.)} 20:42, 5 August 2008 (UTC)

Ok I will put it another way. Out of the first 10 citations I looked at having to do with the Warcraft III manual, 9 of them were wrong.  Rolandius  (talk - contr) 22:37, 5 August 2008 (UTC)

Request for level 74 beta players (especially Horde)

We need more quest givers in the Notes list for the quest  [74] The Magical Kingdom of Dalaran. So far there are only 2 and both Alliance. -- Fandyllic (talk · contr) 3:49 PM PST 5 Aug 2008

Automatic request

You know how after editing something you will sometimes get that message "Thank you for your edit. This article could also use your help:"? Well is the list short or something? I never get anything besides Swiftmend and maybe 2 other suggestions. Aren't there other articles it could suggest for us to help out with?  Rolandius  (talk - contr) 06:22, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

It searches for related stubs, primarily based on the stub category if you were editing a stub, and the other categories on the page. If you edit a character article, it's more likely to suggest character stubs. How to prevent to same stuff coming up again and again? Improve the articles :) Kirkburn  talk  contr 08:34, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

Oh ok cool. I thought it showed some random page to improve and I was somehow getting the same thing over and over.  Rolandius  (talk - contr) 08:44, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

97 Things Every World of Warcraft Player Should Know

Good morning! I have a project to introduce to you all...

I am working on a book project with O'Reilly Media to collect tips for WoW players to compile into a book for publishing. The plan is for it to work thusly: we have a wiki set up where people can submit personal tips of around 250 words, which are then rated up and down, and the best tips are selected for the book.

The difference to WoWWiki is that these tips are each "owned" by the person who wrote them, and the writer gets his name and a short little biography in the book. I think it would complement WoWWiki well as we are not a "personal" guide wiki, and it gives the contributors more of a chance to shine. Whatever happens to the book, the wiki is planned to continue to exist.

The preliminary website is set up at http://commons.ora.com/wiki/index.php/97_Things_-_World_of_Warcraft - I would love for a few users to take a look, give us some feedback and perhaps start a few contributions of your own. I could go into more depth, but the linked page should explain most stuff.

Thanks for reading :) Kirkburn  talk  contr 09:21, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

Heya! After taking a look on your project with O'Reilly Media, I must admit I became very interested in contributing to it... I'm no way a major contributor on WOWWiki, and English is not my main language, but I shall do my best, actively polishing any contributions. My first idea is based on personal experience: an advice/tip about "Auction House Addiction". In short, this would initially enforce the economical stability, such as not expending too much on upgrades and using it as a tool for maximizing your income.

I would like any feedback or suggestions before starting this. May I give a try on this, and be bold? (not so bold as I'm actually asking for authorization hehe :P) RR Fang (talk) 23:26, 10 August 2008 (UTC)

Sure, please do take a look and try writing something.

I've been updating the site today to help make it a bit clearer and have a few more guidelines. We've already got some pretty cool tips from some DuTempete and Fandyllic up. The ball is rolling! Kirkburn  talk  contr 00:38, 11 August 2008 (UTC)

I've started an article about the book/wiki on 97 Things Every World of Warcraft Player Should Know. I'll try and expand it over time with more info. Kirkburn  talk  contr 14:10, 13 August 2008 (UTC)

Heroic order list

Been trying to find a list of the heroics in order... a friend is trying to get enough gear to go to Kara and needs gear. Personally, as a feral druid, I feel The Mechanar and The Botanica are easy, but for a straight rogue instead of a rogue/tank, it may be different. Blood Furnace is rough even for me in my pretty good gear, those Felguard Brutes hit like friggin' trucks.

Anyway, my search-fu failed; if exists such a thing, I couldn't find it. Does anyone know of such a beastie? If not, should we start one? --Azaram (talk) 03:25, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

Take a look at Reputation requirements section of the Heroic article. That looks like a good start. -- Fandyllic (talk · contr) 11:34 AM PST 7 Aug 2008

/2 WTB [Glasses], PST. :-p I swear I looked at that page and didn't see it... Heh. That's exactly what I was looking for, thanks. --Azaram (talk) 07:59, 10 August 2008 (UTC)

Arena Composition or Strategy Articles?

I noticed a lack of arena related material on WoWWiki. For instance, a search for very common arena setups such as 2345/6, Eurocomp, Cleave, or PMR returns no articles. Is there a particular reason Wowwiki has stayed away from these sorts of articles, or has it simply been that no one has created them yet? I'm more than willing to begin some articles. Perhaps enlisting experienced PvPers from forums such as Arena Junkies may help. -- Halcor (talk) 15:23, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

As far as I know there is no policy yet on writing arena articles, and since the nature of arena teams are rather fluid I'd question the need of the kind of articles. Like you have said yourself, the "Arena Junkies" (which I have never heard of myself) might provide you with more information about arena teams and setups. g0urra[T҂C] 15:55, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

I consider myself fairly knowledgable on arena teams and setups, but I think WoWWiki would be a great place for PvPers to view some of the more common compositions and terminology, and perhaps even strengths and weaknesses. Though compositions are fluid, those that tend to become "flavor of the month" stay relatively common. Rarely does a composition outright die. Considering the amount of detail on other parts of the game contained on WoWWiki (such as detailed theorycrafting and boss strategies), articles on arena comps seem conspicuously absent. FYI Arena Junkies is among the most (if not the most) popular arena focused websites with strategy guides, videos, etc... Halcor(talk)

Arena has been a continuing weakness for WoWWiki. I think people were getting so hung up on gear, that not much thought was put into creating build or strategy articles. Also, when some topic lacks information, it usually means no one who creates or contributes to articles has been really interested or they've found much better info other places. If you want to start some articles, just make sure to add [[Category:Arena PvP]] at the end somewhere.

Hopefully your interest has inspired somebody to add content. -- Fandyllic (talk · contr) 12:54 PM PST 7 Aug 2008

Finding all connections to a word (page)

I have two questions. First, how do I see what pages I have created in my User page section? I think there are some pages I have forgotten (User:Rolandius/?) that I want to delete but I can't remember their names. Second, how do I see how many redirects, disambiguations, links, and etc. are to any given term and/or entry?  Rolandius  (talk - contr) 12:51, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

First question -- go to the Special pages, click on All pages with prefix (which should be the 3rd option), type in your user name in the first box, make sure the second box says User, and hit go.

Second question -- On the far left side of the window just under the Google search box is a section known as Toolbox, clicking on What links here should do the trick. Sssssssssssssssssssssssss For Pony! ^{{TDon't hiss at me.•CIf you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all.)} 19:16, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

That worked.

My page seems a bit different but I finally found it cool.LOL Yo Coobra.  Rolandius  (talk - contr) 01:56, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

Loot for Wrath of the Lich King

Some time ago our resident Javascripter, Pcj, simplified the {{loot}} template to use JS to create search links for missing items. Unfortunately, this made it so the search links couldn't easily point to the new DBs for Wowhead and Thottbot. Well, as usually, Pcj quickly fixed that.

To point a loot link to the new βeta DBs, just add |db=wtolk to your template wikicode, like so...

Missing item with search links:

• Wikicode: {{loot|rare|Made up Mysterious Loot|db=wotlk}}
• Result: [Made up Mysterious Loot]

Item we have (|db=wtolk not really needed):

• Wikicode: {{loot|epic|Band of the Kirin Tor|db=wotlk}}
• Result: [Band of the Kirin Tor]

So until the expansion is released, we can use these links. -- Fandyllic (talk · contr) 2:02 PM PST 9 Aug 2008

Fandy and Pcj, I'm not seeing the pop-up for the Band of the Kirin Tor. When I make the link without the db parameter, it comes out as: [Band of the Kirin Tor], and still doesn't have the pop up. Whats the deal? Note that other items seem to be working, as does the error message for the "Made up Mysterious Loot". --Jiyambi t || c 21:07, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

Line breaks in the item tooltip. Should work now. --PcjWowpedia wiki manager (TDrop me a line!•C207,729 contributions and counting) 21:13, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

Thanks Pcj, it works now :) --Jiyambi t || c

Druid epic flight form

Moved to Warcraft pump.

Quest Compilation

Having 6 characters in Outlands (and one more on the way), it occurred to me that every single time I leveled through the game, I stumbled across a great deal of quest content that I'd missed before (not counting the class-specific stuff, which I anticipate). I reference wowwiki a dozen or so times on days I play (atleast 4 days a week) and I'm always impressed at how much data has already been compiled for most of these quests that I 'missed the last time through'.
One thing I've noticed, however, is a lack of uniformity in how the quests are listed in various regions/camps/etc. Some region pages list all the quests available on a camp-by-camp basis, and lately, there's been a shift to just linking a region's quests to it's own page.
Obviously, for some regions, listing all the available quests can be a real page-hog. But including a subsection for 'Quests' that consists exclusively of a link to another page is sort of redundant.
Why not compromise with a collapsible table that lists all the quests? If it's collapsed by default, then the information does not risk over-expanding a page, but is still entirely available to those who want to reference it without leaving the page. <br Additionally, by compiling the quests into collapsible boxes for each camp, a central quest 'index' of sorts will be compiled and easily made into a page that can include every quest in the game that reguires virtually no scrolling (beyond the quest-listings a visitor is interested in).
For example, a visitor can go to the central quest index, expand only the quests they're interested in for a given region (or a specific class/profession) and access any quest details they need very quickly and easily.

-- K10wn (talk) 21:12, 13 August 2008 (UTC)