Despite Vashj's attempts to murder Tyrande and her fighting on the Highborne side during the War of the Ancients, she could certainly be a lot more evil than she is (she's not as bad as Arthas, IMHO, who slaughtered people for no better reason than as a "tribute to Ner'zhul"). So I was never really hoping for her side to lose when playing the Blood Elf campaign in The Frozen Throne. But, I always felt her battle cry of "For Azshara!" was pretty stupid.
Here's what I would have to say to Vashj given the opportunity: "Um, lady, if it weren't for Azshara you wouldn't be a snake-woman. Even if Azshara hadn't been defeated, the Burning Legion would've either enslaved you or killed you. Making deals with demons is very stupid. Just ask the orcs if you need confirmation. You could ask Gul'dan if he were alive, which he isn't, because Kil'jaeden betrayed him by sending him to open up Sargeras' tomb. The only times your new boss Illidan ever did anything to help Kil'jaeden were when he didn't have a choice or when his judgment was clouded by his addiction to the Well's magic and he was faced with the prospect of the Well being destroyed. Azshara, on the other hand, did Kil'jaeden's bidding out of either greed or madness or both, and there was hell to pay. So really, stop admiring her."--Illidan Rocks 22:03, 14 Nov 2005 (EST)
Amen to that, brother. Am I the only one who hopes Tyrande will shoot Vashj full of arrows in the next game? Also, a question- who is the best with the bow: Sylvanas, Vashj, Shandris or Tyrande?--Ragestorm 15:11, 4 Dec 2005 (EST)
- just don't remember who's Shandris xD ==> go to WoWWiki*
For the three other ones, being the captain of the Highborne Watchers, I think Sylvanas would rock them ^^ And for Vashj's cry, I think she's digged too deeply that it's worthless to try to take her up ^^ But you're right, admiring a snaked-tail Night Elf is not so clever ... --Kiro 15:36, 4 Dec 2005 (EST)
While its fair saying Sylvanas is best (it may be true) I must point out that the other three (well, other two, I don't think you can shoot an arrow very well underwater) have a few thousand years experience. Also, I don't think Kil'jaeden betrayed Gul'dan so much as ignored him.--Ragestorm 16:09, 4 Dec 2005 (EST)
- I don't hate Vashj quite as much as you do, Ragestorm. IMO, as long as she's fighting somebody worse than she is she should be kept alive. Afterwards, let Tyrande use Vashj for target practice if she wants to. :p
- I DID kind of make a mistake about Gul'dan's relationship with Kil'jaeden. This might have been retconned by now, but the Warcraft II manual says...
- "With Blackhand's ascension to Warchief, order was restored to the Horde. I was visited again by the visage of Medivh, who appeared more in control of his powers, but less in control of his mind. Petitioning the Horde to destroy the kingdom of Azeroth, but to make him ruler of its people, Medivh offered all manner of treasures and baubles to me. I assured him that this world was ours for the taking, and that he held nothing that could persuade the Horde to do his bidding. His face broke into a wicked sneer as he proceeded to show me the image of an ancient tomb upon which was etched the name of the Daemonlord Sargeras. The Tomb of Sargeras! The Daemonlord who had instructed my own tutor Kil'Jaeden was entombed on this pathetic little world! Destiny had chosen to lay the hand upon my shoulders alone, for Kil'jaeden had told me that the lost Tomb contained power absolute - enough to make any who could control it into a living god. Medivh pledged that he would grant me the location of the Tomb if only I would use the Horde to destroy his enemies..." -Gul'dan
- Gul'dan also mentions Kil'Jaeden had not been answering his calls since Medivh contacted him, almost as if Kil'Jaeden was afraid of Medivh (and if Sargeras' spirit was indeed within Medivh, this doesn't seem so unbelievable a notion). So while Kil'Jaeden originally gave Gul'dan the notion that the tomb was the key to great power, it was Medivh who told him where it was and held it out as a prize for him, all the while knowing that opening the tomb would be suicide.--Illidan Rocks 17:24, 5 Dec 2005 (EST)
Touché, Illidan Rocks! That's an excellent point. Though I can't help but wonder if Kil'jaeden and Sargeras planned the whole thing before Aegwynn even got there. Anyway, going back to Vashj for the moment, her personality seems to have changed in the time since the War. I wonder if Azshara's gotten any brighter? if so, then there's a real problem underneath the Maelstrom. --Ragestorm 19:37, 5 Dec 2005 (EST)
I guess this is as good a place to ask as any: does this mean that the Queen Azshara and Illidan have formed an official alliance? 'cause if it's true, that's pretty bad-ass. Illidan's got himself the better half of Outland and a giant underwater city in Azeroth itself. Not bad at all.
--Wasted 23:03, 3 July 2006 (EDT)
- We just don't know. Given Vashj's obsessive loyalty to Azshara during the War of the Ancients, we assume so, unless she's had a complete personality shift.--Ragestorm 07:41, 4 July 2006 (EDT)
- Now I'm under the assumption that Illidan and Azshara have not formed an alliance of any sort, and that lady Vashj is still fanatically loyal to Azshara, and not to Illidan. Reason being, for lady Vashj doing Illidan's bidding, in my opinion, that Azshara, upon hearing Illidan's summons (reference to Frozen Throne opening cinematic) and recognizing him, decided to let lady Vashj, her (presumably) most trusted servant, take a group of Naga and follow Illidan, to see where his path led. Now, for Vashj's Naga being currently busy in Zangarmarsh, collecting water for Illidan's purpose (Which I've heard is to recreate the Well of Eternity!), and being generally loyal to him to a degree that would go beyond my mentioned guess, I cannot say. Perhaps Azshara liked what Illidan was planning, and ordered Vashj to continue her work? Hopefully, these things will be sorted out in upcoming events.--NerdKnight Xavier 13:36, 21 February 2007 (EST)
Four arms or six?
With the recent discovery of Akama, and his model shift from Lost One to Broken as depicted in Rei's artwork, does it look like Vashj will have six arms instead of the four female nagas usually have? AzraelOpacus 14:53, 1 December 2006 (EST)
- It would appear so, though not for the same reasons; Akama was established as Broken some time ago, so it wasn't like they were going to leave him with a Lost One model. With Vashj, they were just using the normal Sea Witch model in WC3, so it's possible that they've decided Azshara's handmaidens are a cut above the normal Sirens or Sea Witches, and have six arms. Or, Sirens could have four and Sea Witches six. Some explanation like that.--Ragestorm 17:49, 1 December 2006 (EST)
- Guys, it appears that she has six like he said. Someone uploaded a datamined picture of her (kind of a sucky picture because the dude didn't frame the whole whole body) buy you can see a "fifth" arm slightly behind the second set of arms. Really cool model. But as to WHY, i think there isn't a standard for the naga important characters. Because we've all seen that Older and more important nagas develop different features...We can see that in this case and in Azshara too, who has the lower part of an octopus and snakes on her head like vashj. I think it's just a little design detail.--Pulyx 04:23, 17 December 2006 (EST)
- Works for me. Someone remove that datamined image, please. --Ragestorm 10:29, 17 December 2006 (EST)
- Correct me please, if I am wrong on this subject, but I got the impression that the "datamine-image-is-a-no-no"-deal was for the beta-test period only, and would not last beyond that. And by the way, that image rocks! It shows off the in-game model of Vashj in a dynamic way, that no screenshot wwould be able to do, since screenshots of instance-bosses are either just the boss, standing in their position, before combat, or blurry shots when combat has already begun, were all the spell-animation blocks the view of what we're meant to see. if I'm right about the aforementioned issue, can we pretty-please have that image back?--NerdKnight Xavier 13:14, 21 February 2007 (EST)
As far as I know, datamining is never allowed. Please check the dates of posts, as that comment was a while ago, and I have no recollection of that particular image.--Ragestorm (talk · contr) 13:55, 21 February 2007 (EST)
Lore vs. Tactics
What about making two pages, a la Kel'Thuzad, one for lore and one for tactics? --Tinkerer 16:23, 23 December 2006 (EST)
- Talk:Illidan Stormrage--Ragestorm, Head Bookkeeper 16:46, 23 December 2006 (EST)
Picture deleted
The concept picture was shown twice so I removed one. --Blackmorsel